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	<title>Comments on: Swine Flu:  H1N1 Vaccine Pitting Mom Against Mom</title>
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		<title>By: KWombles</title>
		<link>http://www.catherine-morgan.com/2009/11/02/swine-flu-h1n1-vaccine-pitting-mom-against-mom/comment-page-1/#comment-2255</link>
		<dc:creator>KWombles</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 04 Nov 2009 20:53:36 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.catherine-morgan.com/?p=873#comment-2255</guid>
		<description>&quot;If the vaccine works, then you have nothing to fear from someone who chose not to get their child vaccinated.&quot; Catherine, you&#039;re a nurse, so you really ought to be aware that immunizations are not  100% effective. The more people immunized, the less possibility a virus has of infecting someone within a group. It&#039;s called herd immunity.

And it&#039;s not bullying to put out factual information in a matter-of-fact way. One of your roles as a nurse involves patient education. You have an obligation to provide factual information to your patients. 

As to being judgmental, is that not what you are engaged in here? And it should be noted, judging other people&#039;s decision making processes is not bullying. Not even close.

As to your contention that loving your children makes you a good parent, apparently regardless of the decisions you make for their care, no. Not true. I&#039;m sure the parent of the child with type 1 diabetes who let her child die rather than get her medical care loved her child. It did not make her a good parent. Loving isn&#039;t enough. Making responsible decisions based on accurate information using reason and logic are part of being a good parent. Not all of it, but a huge part of the medical decisions we are required to make for our children&#039;s care.

If it appears that the discussion of H1N1 vaccination has been overtaken by the autism/vaccination manufactuversy, that can be laid squarely at the door of organizations like Age of Autism, who has taken the lead with misinformation. Mercola, Gordon, and various homeopathic experts at Huffington Post further woo up the waters and make it difficult for the average consumer to get to accurate information on the internet.

The H1N1 vaccine is the same vaccine as the regular flu shot; the virus strain varies. That actually means that it has been studied in some detail, as the only variation is the strain. That&#039;s something you really should understand.

There are people who should not get vaccinated. These people are at risk, and a good citizen, a good parent, a good friend, a good neighbor who can get safely vaccinated should want to protect not only themselves, but the people around them from a preventable illness that has killed over 120 children since April. Seriously. And it&#039;s not bullying to say so. It&#039;s facts about the illness, facts about vaccination, and a call to be responsible.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8220;If the vaccine works, then you have nothing to fear from someone who chose not to get their child vaccinated.&#8221; Catherine, you&#8217;re a nurse, so you really ought to be aware that immunizations are not  100% effective. The more people immunized, the less possibility a virus has of infecting someone within a group. It&#8217;s called herd immunity.</p>
<p>And it&#8217;s not bullying to put out factual information in a matter-of-fact way. One of your roles as a nurse involves patient education. You have an obligation to provide factual information to your patients. </p>
<p>As to being judgmental, is that not what you are engaged in here? And it should be noted, judging other people&#8217;s decision making processes is not bullying. Not even close.</p>
<p>As to your contention that loving your children makes you a good parent, apparently regardless of the decisions you make for their care, no. Not true. I&#8217;m sure the parent of the child with type 1 diabetes who let her child die rather than get her medical care loved her child. It did not make her a good parent. Loving isn&#8217;t enough. Making responsible decisions based on accurate information using reason and logic are part of being a good parent. Not all of it, but a huge part of the medical decisions we are required to make for our children&#8217;s care.</p>
<p>If it appears that the discussion of H1N1 vaccination has been overtaken by the autism/vaccination manufactuversy, that can be laid squarely at the door of organizations like Age of Autism, who has taken the lead with misinformation. Mercola, Gordon, and various homeopathic experts at Huffington Post further woo up the waters and make it difficult for the average consumer to get to accurate information on the internet.</p>
<p>The H1N1 vaccine is the same vaccine as the regular flu shot; the virus strain varies. That actually means that it has been studied in some detail, as the only variation is the strain. That&#8217;s something you really should understand.</p>
<p>There are people who should not get vaccinated. These people are at risk, and a good citizen, a good parent, a good friend, a good neighbor who can get safely vaccinated should want to protect not only themselves, but the people around them from a preventable illness that has killed over 120 children since April. Seriously. And it&#8217;s not bullying to say so. It&#8217;s facts about the illness, facts about vaccination, and a call to be responsible.</p>
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		<title>By: Sandy</title>
		<link>http://www.catherine-morgan.com/2009/11/02/swine-flu-h1n1-vaccine-pitting-mom-against-mom/comment-page-1/#comment-2253</link>
		<dc:creator>Sandy</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 04 Nov 2009 05:47:03 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.catherine-morgan.com/?p=873#comment-2253</guid>
		<description>Emily-thanks for your last post. I appreciated you comments. Stay healthy.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Emily-thanks for your last post. I appreciated you comments. Stay healthy.</p>
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		<title>By: Emily</title>
		<link>http://www.catherine-morgan.com/2009/11/02/swine-flu-h1n1-vaccine-pitting-mom-against-mom/comment-page-1/#comment-2252</link>
		<dc:creator>Emily</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 04 Nov 2009 04:27:54 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.catherine-morgan.com/?p=873#comment-2252</guid>
		<description>Sandy, I&#039;m not &quot;taking out my frustrations&quot; on anyone. I&#039;m just appreciating an irony and making a point. There&#039;s no particular &quot;tone&quot; I&#039;m using either...just being factual or clearly stating an opinion. I can&#039;t see what there is in my &quot;choice of words&quot; that bothers you, but I&#039;m not you, so that&#039;s something from your perspective. I write and speak in exactly the same way, and most people I know wouldn&#039;t exactly describe me as overly emotionally expressive. Far from it, actually.

And there is a right answer based on correct information. The point of that statement is that if you have correct information, you&#039;ll make a correctly informed decision. Vaccination is not for everyone, and not everyone should or can be vaccinated. But that decision should not be made based on misinformation. There is nothing in my post that blames anyone. I&#039;m simply pointing out that the divide among parents, especially mothers, regarding vaccination is not a chasm that began opening with the advent of H1N1. It began a much longer time ago, and some of us have been hollering across it for many years. You saw fit to come at what I wrote from a certain perspective which appears to have colored your perceptions of my comments. 

Once again, I do not see how even becoming angry at someone else over the vaccine controversy equates to bullying or &quot;slamming.&quot; Once again, I don&#039;t see any disadvantaged populations here. If an adult has an opinion or a stance, it should be defensible, and they should be able to defend it. There&#039;s no problem in that, and no bullying, either.

Cheers,
Emily</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Sandy, I&#8217;m not &#8220;taking out my frustrations&#8221; on anyone. I&#8217;m just appreciating an irony and making a point. There&#8217;s no particular &#8220;tone&#8221; I&#8217;m using either&#8230;just being factual or clearly stating an opinion. I can&#8217;t see what there is in my &#8220;choice of words&#8221; that bothers you, but I&#8217;m not you, so that&#8217;s something from your perspective. I write and speak in exactly the same way, and most people I know wouldn&#8217;t exactly describe me as overly emotionally expressive. Far from it, actually.</p>
<p>And there is a right answer based on correct information. The point of that statement is that if you have correct information, you&#8217;ll make a correctly informed decision. Vaccination is not for everyone, and not everyone should or can be vaccinated. But that decision should not be made based on misinformation. There is nothing in my post that blames anyone. I&#8217;m simply pointing out that the divide among parents, especially mothers, regarding vaccination is not a chasm that began opening with the advent of H1N1. It began a much longer time ago, and some of us have been hollering across it for many years. You saw fit to come at what I wrote from a certain perspective which appears to have colored your perceptions of my comments. </p>
<p>Once again, I do not see how even becoming angry at someone else over the vaccine controversy equates to bullying or &#8220;slamming.&#8221; Once again, I don&#8217;t see any disadvantaged populations here. If an adult has an opinion or a stance, it should be defensible, and they should be able to defend it. There&#8217;s no problem in that, and no bullying, either.</p>
<p>Cheers,<br />
Emily</p>
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		<title>By: Dawn</title>
		<link>http://www.catherine-morgan.com/2009/11/02/swine-flu-h1n1-vaccine-pitting-mom-against-mom/comment-page-1/#comment-2251</link>
		<dc:creator>Dawn</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 03 Nov 2009 18:31:27 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.catherine-morgan.com/?p=873#comment-2251</guid>
		<description>Hi!
 
First, I wanted to give you an article I wrote on the recently approved U.S. H1N1 Vaccines.
 
MedImmune&#039;s Nasal Spray leaves you contagious for at least 3 weeks.  See page 19 of their package insert.  The medical community is responsible for these outbreaks because this is the very first vaccine that became available.  
 
http://vactruth.com/2009/10/02/fda-approved-h1n1-vaccines-contain-ingredients-known-to-cause-cancer-and-death/
 
Second, read &quot;Fear of the Invisible&quot; by Janine Roberts.  You will then understand why the entire world is facing an utterly devasting crisis.  It is just a matter of time before the majority of the population is infected.  These vaccine contaminants are sexually transmitted and genetic.  After reading the book you will also understand why cancer now affects 1 in every 200 children.  25% will die despite treatment.  This book explains in great detail all of the secret government meetings that have taken place over the years regarding the safety of vaccines.  Did you know that for 10 years our government officials KNEW that vaccines were causing breast cancer and that HPV was a vaccine contaminant?  These are just 2 alarming facts out of many.
 
Neurotoxins do not cause Autism.  They simply add fuel to the fire by allowing vaccine contaminants to cross the blood-brain barrier.
 
Did you also know that if you receive any vaccine and subsequently come down with the symptoms/disease (which is listed as a possible side effect) 2 weeks after receiving the vaccine - according to the medical community you are considered UNVACCINATED?!  Also, say your child is 4 years old and comes down with pertussis after receiving 4 doses of DTaP since the age of 2 months.  According to the medical community, your child would be also considered UNVACCINATED because the series was not yet completed (last dose at the age of 5 is recommended).  I have to laugh when I read reports of outbreaks of unvaccinated children.  It is all lies.  Vaccines have NEVER been proven to work - in fact, there is plenty of evidence that they cause most diseases - to include chronic fatigue syndrome (retrovirus vaccine contaminant).
 
If you ever care to read about my family&#039;s vaccine-induced nightmare, go to Sept 2008 at http://vaccinesexposed.blogspot.com
 
Thanks,
 
Dawn Crim</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hi!</p>
<p>First, I wanted to give you an article I wrote on the recently approved U.S. H1N1 Vaccines.</p>
<p>MedImmune&#8217;s Nasal Spray leaves you contagious for at least 3 weeks.  See page 19 of their package insert.  The medical community is responsible for these outbreaks because this is the very first vaccine that became available.  </p>
<p><a href="http://vactruth.com/2009/10/02/fda-approved-h1n1-vaccines-contain-ingredients-known-to-cause-cancer-and-death/" rel="nofollow">http://vactruth.com/2009/10/02/fda-approved-h1n1-vaccines-contain-ingredients-known-to-cause-cancer-and-death/</a></p>
<p>Second, read &#8220;Fear of the Invisible&#8221; by Janine Roberts.  You will then understand why the entire world is facing an utterly devasting crisis.  It is just a matter of time before the majority of the population is infected.  These vaccine contaminants are sexually transmitted and genetic.  After reading the book you will also understand why cancer now affects 1 in every 200 children.  25% will die despite treatment.  This book explains in great detail all of the secret government meetings that have taken place over the years regarding the safety of vaccines.  Did you know that for 10 years our government officials KNEW that vaccines were causing breast cancer and that HPV was a vaccine contaminant?  These are just 2 alarming facts out of many.</p>
<p>Neurotoxins do not cause Autism.  They simply add fuel to the fire by allowing vaccine contaminants to cross the blood-brain barrier.</p>
<p>Did you also know that if you receive any vaccine and subsequently come down with the symptoms/disease (which is listed as a possible side effect) 2 weeks after receiving the vaccine &#8211; according to the medical community you are considered UNVACCINATED?!  Also, say your child is 4 years old and comes down with pertussis after receiving 4 doses of DTaP since the age of 2 months.  According to the medical community, your child would be also considered UNVACCINATED because the series was not yet completed (last dose at the age of 5 is recommended).  I have to laugh when I read reports of outbreaks of unvaccinated children.  It is all lies.  Vaccines have NEVER been proven to work &#8211; in fact, there is plenty of evidence that they cause most diseases &#8211; to include chronic fatigue syndrome (retrovirus vaccine contaminant).</p>
<p>If you ever care to read about my family&#8217;s vaccine-induced nightmare, go to Sept 2008 at <a href="http://vaccinesexposed.blogspot.com" rel="nofollow">http://vaccinesexposed.blogspot.com</a></p>
<p>Thanks,</p>
<p>Dawn Crim</p>
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		<title>By: Sandy</title>
		<link>http://www.catherine-morgan.com/2009/11/02/swine-flu-h1n1-vaccine-pitting-mom-against-mom/comment-page-1/#comment-2250</link>
		<dc:creator>Sandy</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 03 Nov 2009 14:33:57 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.catherine-morgan.com/?p=873#comment-2250</guid>
		<description>Here&#039;s the point: I haven&#039;t decided either. I read everything I can find and discredit any comment that sound of conspiracy (Expat, you misinterpreted the comment.) In this debate, the &quot;side&quot; most often getting slammed are those questioning the vaccine. When Emily began her comment with &quot;There is a right answer about vaccination based on correct information.&quot; It created the &quot;sides&quot; in black and white. If it really is each parents right, then why toss in the &quot;social responsibility&quot; bombshell. What I see out there are parents, agonizing about the decision. I empathize with that. There are many who question the vaccine who have gone ahead and vaccinated their children, we need to support them in their decision rather than blame, and remember to do likewise for those who make a different decision.  It is possible for thinking people to have the same set of facts and come to different conclusions, especially when the specific situation is new, there are various factors or compounds used, statistics are malleable, and the virus is mutating constantly. Sometimes the best available science is proven wrong. That&#039;s how we get to better science. I am not sure where we will end up here, but even the quoted scientists leave room for that possibility. What we need in this conversation are cooler, more empathetic hearts and heads all around.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Here&#8217;s the point: I haven&#8217;t decided either. I read everything I can find and discredit any comment that sound of conspiracy (Expat, you misinterpreted the comment.) In this debate, the &#8220;side&#8221; most often getting slammed are those questioning the vaccine. When Emily began her comment with &#8220;There is a right answer about vaccination based on correct information.&#8221; It created the &#8220;sides&#8221; in black and white. If it really is each parents right, then why toss in the &#8220;social responsibility&#8221; bombshell. What I see out there are parents, agonizing about the decision. I empathize with that. There are many who question the vaccine who have gone ahead and vaccinated their children, we need to support them in their decision rather than blame, and remember to do likewise for those who make a different decision.  It is possible for thinking people to have the same set of facts and come to different conclusions, especially when the specific situation is new, there are various factors or compounds used, statistics are malleable, and the virus is mutating constantly. Sometimes the best available science is proven wrong. That&#8217;s how we get to better science. I am not sure where we will end up here, but even the quoted scientists leave room for that possibility. What we need in this conversation are cooler, more empathetic hearts and heads all around.</p>
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		<title>By: Expat Mum</title>
		<link>http://www.catherine-morgan.com/2009/11/02/swine-flu-h1n1-vaccine-pitting-mom-against-mom/comment-page-1/#comment-2249</link>
		<dc:creator>Expat Mum</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 03 Nov 2009 03:23:02 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.catherine-morgan.com/?p=873#comment-2249</guid>
		<description>The above &quot;debate&quot; is just the problem. There was nothing disrespectful in Emily&#039;s post. The tone was impassioned but not insulting. The trouble here is there is no room for disagreement and when someone gives you the facts they have read, it becomes &quot;bullying&quot;. Enily made no negative comments whatsoever about people who disagree with her, in fact, at the beginning of her comment she made it clear that she believes parents have the right to vaccinate their children or not. To say her&#039;s was a consiratorial decision was almost laughable and made me wonder if Sandy knew the meaning of the word. And that&#039;s from someone who&#039;s still trying to decide. Sandy&#039;s comment to me, is far more &quot;unhelpful&quot; as it cheapens the debate and introduces non-factual, distracting elements.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The above &#8220;debate&#8221; is just the problem. There was nothing disrespectful in Emily&#8217;s post. The tone was impassioned but not insulting. The trouble here is there is no room for disagreement and when someone gives you the facts they have read, it becomes &#8220;bullying&#8221;. Enily made no negative comments whatsoever about people who disagree with her, in fact, at the beginning of her comment she made it clear that she believes parents have the right to vaccinate their children or not. To say her&#8217;s was a consiratorial decision was almost laughable and made me wonder if Sandy knew the meaning of the word. And that&#8217;s from someone who&#8217;s still trying to decide. Sandy&#8217;s comment to me, is far more &#8220;unhelpful&#8221; as it cheapens the debate and introduces non-factual, distracting elements.</p>
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		<title>By: sandy</title>
		<link>http://www.catherine-morgan.com/2009/11/02/swine-flu-h1n1-vaccine-pitting-mom-against-mom/comment-page-1/#comment-2247</link>
		<dc:creator>sandy</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 02 Nov 2009 22:59:47 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.catherine-morgan.com/?p=873#comment-2247</guid>
		<description>Emily, the tone of your comments and choice of words are unhelpful. If you have been wrongly criticized by others, that too is a problem. But please don&#039;t take your frustration out on other parents who are struggling with making informed choices about their children&#039;s health and care. You may not be able to see it, but there are many of us out here who are making informed, non-conspiratorial decisions.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Emily, the tone of your comments and choice of words are unhelpful. If you have been wrongly criticized by others, that too is a problem. But please don&#8217;t take your frustration out on other parents who are struggling with making informed choices about their children&#8217;s health and care. You may not be able to see it, but there are many of us out here who are making informed, non-conspiratorial decisions.</p>
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		<title>By: Emily</title>
		<link>http://www.catherine-morgan.com/2009/11/02/swine-flu-h1n1-vaccine-pitting-mom-against-mom/comment-page-1/#comment-2244</link>
		<dc:creator>Emily</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 02 Nov 2009 20:15:48 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.catherine-morgan.com/?p=873#comment-2244</guid>
		<description>There is a right answer about vaccination based on correct information. The problem is the surfeit of bad information, leading to poorly informed choices. Yes, parents have the right to vaccinate their children or to choose not to do so. I do not, however, see how voicing facts that counter erroneous assumptions rises to the level of bullying. As a parent who has weathered a few years of the autism-vaccine wars, I can assure you that much of the bashing about &quot;bad parenting,&quot; specifically &quot;bad mothering,&quot; comes at me from people who make any number of wrong assumptions about me and have no compunction about accusing me and anyone else like me who vaccinates their children of being guilty of child abuse. This &quot;mom vs. mom&quot; battle has been going on for several years and has only become more generalized with the H1N1 misinformation campaigns.

All that said, I view vaccination as more than a parenting decision. It is also a social responsibility decision. Having this conversation with people, voicing my opinion, and reinforcing what I say with facts does not rise to the level of bullying. I don&#039;t see a disadvantaged population being browbeaten here.

Cheers,
Emily</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>There is a right answer about vaccination based on correct information. The problem is the surfeit of bad information, leading to poorly informed choices. Yes, parents have the right to vaccinate their children or to choose not to do so. I do not, however, see how voicing facts that counter erroneous assumptions rises to the level of bullying. As a parent who has weathered a few years of the autism-vaccine wars, I can assure you that much of the bashing about &#8220;bad parenting,&#8221; specifically &#8220;bad mothering,&#8221; comes at me from people who make any number of wrong assumptions about me and have no compunction about accusing me and anyone else like me who vaccinates their children of being guilty of child abuse. This &#8220;mom vs. mom&#8221; battle has been going on for several years and has only become more generalized with the H1N1 misinformation campaigns.</p>
<p>All that said, I view vaccination as more than a parenting decision. It is also a social responsibility decision. Having this conversation with people, voicing my opinion, and reinforcing what I say with facts does not rise to the level of bullying. I don&#8217;t see a disadvantaged population being browbeaten here.</p>
<p>Cheers,<br />
Emily</p>
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